6 points!

[Doc Holiday]

Congratulations to White Flight who scored RCR's first ever (I believe) 6 point scoring pass at Wednesday night's scrimmage.

[Roarshock Tess]

What???

[dancingscott]

I knew she was fast, but not THAT fast.

[Mark Armstrong]

Explain...

[Doc Holiday]

Think of it as a quiz for super fans; discuss.

[Artemis Foulmouth]

Did the opposing team field too many blockers?

or, did she get two points for lapping the jammer while simultaneously reversing the jammer back a whole lap? or something super complicated like that?

This is exciting! do tell!

[scarlene]

no comprende

[Uff-da]

Jammer A (WF) is on her first scoring pass while Jammer B is stuck at the back of the pack still on her initial pass. Jammer A passes Jammer B scoring one point for lapping her. Jammer B gets taken out and by the time she is back in the pack has lapped her. Jammer A passes the opposing blockers for four points. Jammer A passes Jammer B lapping her again. Another point. Jammer A clears the engagement zone successfully achieving a six-point pass.

Something like that?

[Baccha Nailya]

Jammer A (WF) is on her first scoring pass while Jammer B is stuck at the back of the pack still on her initial pass. Jammer A passes Jammer B scoring one point for lapping her. Jammer B gets taken out and by the time she is back in the pack has lapped her. Jammer A passes the opposing blockers for four points. Jammer A passes Jammer B lapping her again. Another point. Jammer A clears the engagement zone successfully achieving a six-point pass.

Something like that?

Uff-da, if it was a jam where I was Jammer B, that sounds about right

[Doc Holiday]

While Uff-Da's scenario is possible, I think it is much less likely than what actually happened. Also, in that scenario the jammer B would have to be so beat up she could barely skate and the entire pack could lap her, but not beat up enough that the jam is called because she's lying down on the track. Whitey's 6-point pass was due to her own sheer awesomeness, as well as her teammate's great defense, of course.

Whitey was on her first scoring pass while jammer B was stuck in the pack on her initial pass. As Whitey made her way through the pack, jammer B cleared the pack just in front of her. As they left the front engagement zone, jammer B was 2 feet in front of Whitey. This being unacceptable to Whitey, she caught her, hip-checked her down and out of bounds, and proceeded on her way around the track. When jammer B got back up she was an eaten baby, back in the pack.

-> When Whitey passed jammer B, she had left the front engagement zone and therefore had started a new scoring pass. When she passed jammer B it was the first point on the new (2nd) pass.

As Whitey made her way through the pack on her 2nd scoring pass, jammer B was still stuck in the pack. When Whitey completed that scoring pass by leaving the front engagement zone she had lapped all 4 blockers once and the jammer twice. 6 points.

Keep in mind that a 6 point pass is pretty much exactly like having an amplifier that has dials that go up to 11. In order to get those 6 points it meant the prior pass had to be 4. 5+5=10 4+6=10

That said, there's no question that everyone else only gets 5 points on a scoring pass and Whitey gets 6.

[white flight RISK]

I looked this up and it was explained a bit differently. It focuses on wording:

8.3 After clearing the pack and completing her initial (first) pass, Jammers score points by passing skaters on their second and each subsequent pass. These are considered “scoring passes.” Jammers can score a maximum of one point per Blocker per scoring pass.

"This rule says that Jammers score points by "passing skaters". This is because a point can be gained by passing both opposing Blockers and the opposing Jammer. The rule then goes on to say that a Jammer may score a "maximum one point per Blocker per scoring pass" but says no such similar statement about Jammers. This distinction is what makes Jammer Lap Points, points scored by a Jammer completely lapping the opposing Jammer, independent from scoring passes.

Here's a simple explanation of what I mean. During a scoring pass a Jammer scores only one point per legally passed Blocker no matter how many subsequent times she may pass that Blocker before she finishes her scoring pass. However, even if a Jammer is on the same scoring pass and completely laps the Jammer seven times, she will score seven Jammer Lap Points. While only one JLP is typically scored per scoring pass, JLPs may be scored as many times as possible no matter what scoring pass a Jammer is on and no matter how many Blocker points she has scored, even if she hasn't scored any. This why some have seen the elusive "6 point pass" (or 7 or 8 or even more)."

Does this mean that if I were to pass the jammer and recycle her from outside the engagement zone (first point), while getting recycled myself and passing her a second time (2nd point) then completing the next scoring pass including the jammer a third time that I could get seven points?? If this is the case, then Jammer Lap Points could be accrued anytime one jammer gets out and begins her scoring but gets stuck in the pack. We have seen jammers stuck in the pack this way a million times. Should the lead/scoring pass jammer be accumulating jammer points for every time she passes the other jammer regardless of whether or not she actually made it out of the engagement zone?

I hope this makes sense...

[Doc Holiday]

To answer the question in your last paragraph: no.

8.4 A Jammer pass, either initial or scoring, cannot be initiated by entering the pack from the front. If
a Jammer who has exited the front of the engagement zone is then swallowed backward into the
front engagement zone and/or pack, she returns to her previous pass (see Section 8.6.2.1) until
she again re-exits the front engagement zone.

and

8.6.6 Jammer Lap Point: If one Jammer completely laps the opposing Jammer, she will score
one (1) point each time she fully laps her.

One way to think of it is with the now-popular spiral staircase analogy. For instance, when a blocker is touching the jammer line on the jam start whistle, she is an entire lap ahead of the pack. Or, if the track were a spiral staircase, she is one full turn "above" her teammates. That's why she has to wait for the pack to skate an entire lap to catch up with her or skate CW all the way back to the pack or she gets a false start major penalty.

When the scoring jammer is swallowed back into the front engagement zone on a pass, she is back on the scoring lap she just finished. The difference being, since she already left the front engagement zone and started her next scoring pass, she is now unable to score any points she may have missed while she was initially on that scoring lap.

Interestingly, though, if the opposing jammer was winded badly or had a seized wheel or something and continued to skate slowly while the pack was racing with the scoring jammer still in the pack, you could get your 7th, 8th, etc. point. On the other hand, if the slow jammer took herself off the track for equipment failure or lack of wind, the scoring jammer would only get a maximum of 1 point per scoring pass since the other jammer would now be a NOTT (ghost) point.

Has there ever been a scoring pass recorded over 6 points? Does anyone know?

[ndykman]

For me, this came down to: What is a lap? Because this is how the point is scored, by lapping the jammer.

Well, a lap is defined as "A complete pass through the pack; this may require more than one trip around the track".

Given this definition, I argue that Whitey did not lap Jammer B, because Jammer B was not in the pack when the pass occured. No lap, no lap point.

What would help would be to add the text: "A lap starts when you enter the rear engagement zone and ends when you leave the front engagement zone."

So my take is that she did not get 6 points.

[Doc Holiday]

The lap questions/scenarios are already covered in the rules.

8.3.1.2 Once the Jammer has cleared the foremost pack skater by twenty (20)
feet/exited the front of the engagement zone, her scoring pass is complete (see
Sections 3.4 Lead Jammer and 4.1 Pack Definition) and she immediately begins
her next scoring pass.

8.6.6 Jammer Lap Point: If one Jammer completely laps the opposing Jammer, she will score
one (1) point each time she fully laps her.

I think that answers all your concerns. Jammer lap points and blocker lap points are tracked and scored independently. The only connection is when the jammer lap points are signaled: at the end of each "scoring pass".